Ross Bank 1800

Banknotes issued by Irish Private Banks ca1700–ca1833
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ThePloughman
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Ross Bank 1800

Post by ThePloughman »

Here's another strange denomination!

A Ross Bank 9 Shilling note. Date looks like 23 Jan 1800.

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DOC
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

The 9 shilling denomination was also know as a 'Silver' note. The Ross Bank had two registered partners, George Roe and his brother Peter. This one is signed by Peter Roe.

I attach a later example of a 4 Guinea note from this bank. This denomination is readily available to collectors as a hoard of partly issued and non-issued notes was discovered some time ago. The attached note is a fully issued example from 1814.
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Ross Bank 4 Guineas 1st Sept. 1814 Peter Roe.jpg
Ross Bank 4 Guineas 1st Sept. 1814 Peter Roe.jpg (105.3 KiB) Viewed 12488 times
Last edited by DOC on 08 Aug 2018 21:25, edited 1 time in total.
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Mac
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

I have seen very few fully issued examples of these notes. That's quite a nice one.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

The 3 Guinea note appears to be scarcer than the 4 Guinea note. Here is a partially issued example without signature.
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Ross Bank 3 Guineas 1st Nov. 1814.jpg
Ross Bank 3 Guineas 1st Nov. 1814.jpg (125.3 KiB) Viewed 12487 times
Last edited by DOC on 08 Aug 2018 21:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

I can't recall seeing a 3 Guinea note before!
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

Here is a fully issued 1 Guinea note signed by Peter Roe. Few examples survive.
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Ross Bank 1 Guinea Sept. 1st 1814 Peter Roe.jpg
Ross Bank 1 Guinea Sept. 1st 1814 Peter Roe.jpg (102.4 KiB) Viewed 12486 times
Last edited by DOC on 08 Aug 2018 21:32, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by ThePloughman »

I figure 3 and 4 Guineas are scarcer denominations. Are there other odd notes, 5 or 6 Guineas perhaps?
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

For this bank, the lower denominations are much scarcer. The primary reason for this is that a hoard of partly issues 4 guinea notes turned up some time ago. I have not seen a 5 or 6 Guinea note from this bank but it is possible they were issued. The only other recorded denomination is for 30 Shillings (scan attached).
Attachments
Ross Bank 30 Shillings 1st July 1805 Peter Roe.jpg
Ross Bank 30 Shillings 1st July 1805 Peter Roe.jpg (113.99 KiB) Viewed 12485 times
Last edited by DOC on 08 Aug 2018 21:35, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by ThePloughman »

I guess that as many of these banks went broke without paying their notes up, there are potentially a lot of unpaid notes hanging around for us collectors.
How often do hoards turn up, any new material recently?
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

Irish Private Bank notes are generally quite scarce. Hoards are few and far between ! Not much material has turned up in recent years. The most recent old note hoard that I can recall (not a Private Bank) was a group of cancelled Hibernian Joint Stock Bank notes from the 1820's. Some of these are posted on the Forum. I would be curious to know if anyone can remember how the large group of Ffrenchs' Bank notes (Dublin & Tuam) originally came to market.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

Yes, the Hibernian Token notes which turned up were the first issued examples I had seen. I had recorded only the odd proof before that.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

The vignette on Ross Bank 3 Guineas and 4 Guineas notes depicts a female figure leaning on an anchor looking out to see. I have seen this vignette on other Irish Private Bank notes and post bills and wondered if it has any significance. The attached link provides an insight and indicates that this depiction is symbolic of ‘Hope’.

https ://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/42045.html
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Vignette Ross Bank 3 Guineas 1st Nov.1814.jpg
Vignette Ross Bank 3 Guineas 1st Nov.1814.jpg (124.62 KiB) Viewed 9976 times
Hope.JPG
Hope.JPG (21.88 KiB) Viewed 9976 times
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

HIbernia hoping for a better future...

Probably a standard design idea in use by banknote printers of the day. Also used on some later joint stock banknotes, and Bank of Ireland notes.
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

Here is a £1 note for Peter Roe, Ross, dated 29 Sep 1806.
Peter-Roe-Ross-1-Pound-29-Sep-1806.jpg
Peter-Roe-Ross-1-Pound-29-Sep-1806.jpg (50.43 KiB) Viewed 2496 times
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

Nice to see a previously unrecorded denomination turning up. It is curious that for this bank, the lower denominations (£1, 1 Guinea, 30 Shillings) are much rarer than the higher denominations (3 & 4 Guineas).
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by LimerickNomad »

DOC wrote: 18 Jan 2022 19:29 Nice to see a previously unrecorded denomination turning up. It is curious that for this bank, the lower denominations (£1, 1 Guinea, 30 Shillings) are much rarer than the higher denominations (3 & 4 Guineas).
But "turning up" from where exactly, DOC? Where have these notes been for the last 200+ years?
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

LimerickNomad wrote: 19 Jan 2022 17:05
DOC wrote: 18 Jan 2022 19:29 Nice to see a previously unrecorded denomination turning up. It is curious that for this bank, the lower denominations (£1, 1 Guinea, 30 Shillings) are much rarer than the higher denominations (3 & 4 Guineas).
But "turning up" from where exactly, DOC? Where have these notes been for the last 200+ years?
That is a good question and it is not always clear where these items have resided over the years. I would guess that the original holders of the notes kept them as heirlooms when the banks went bust. They eventually turn up at auction or at a show when a descendent decides to sell them. New discoveries are continually emerging and this is an exciting aspect of the hobby :)
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by Mac »

Here are pictures of the note as I received it. It is likely that the note has not come from a collection.
An antiques and collectibles auctioneer in England had it for sale.
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ross-peter-roe-01.jpg
ross-peter-roe-01.jpg (65.16 KiB) Viewed 2413 times
peter-roe-rev.jpg
peter-roe-rev.jpg (58.91 KiB) Viewed 2413 times
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

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I was pleased that it was actually in better overall condition than it looked initially!
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Re: Ross Bank 1800

Post by DOC »

Here is an interesting unissued note denominated in British Shillings and associated with Ross (New Ross, Co.Wexford).The initials in the monogram are ‘RR’ and the promissory text is in the form of an ‘IOU’. PMI classifies this note as a ‘Tradesman’ note dating from the early 1800’s and the issuer is likely to be a local business person.
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Ross Trademan's Note British Shillings ca.1800.jpg
Ross Trademan's Note British Shillings ca.1800.jpg (119.17 KiB) Viewed 359 times
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